And we're at it again! Welcome to this week's Ash vs Evil Dead episode discussion thread! Some additional ground rules to the basic ones on the forum for those who want to participate:
1: This and all future threads will be a choose to warn experience; IE you will not need to use spoiler bars to talk about things that happened in this and previous episodes.
2: It is, however, advisable to use spoiler bars if you want to talk about spoilers for an unaired episode.
3: Please be respectful of the opinions of your fellow Deadites; some people may not love the episode as much as you do; some may love it more. Discussion and debate are good things.
LAST WEEK'S THREAD:
n/a.
SUMMARY:
After being the hero of Elk Grove by defeating evil and saving humanity, Ash settles in and opens a hardware store; his peace is short-lived when evil returns with a target close to his heart.
As posted in the other thread, I thought this was a solid premiere. Maybe not incredible or anything but I did hear that the show begins to pick up in later episodes. There were some really solid "Evil Dead" moments, a fair amount of action, some slapstick, some humor and what not. I enjoyed it quite a bit and I am happy it's back as I really missed it.
As posted in the other thread, I thought this was a solid premiere. Maybe not incredible or anything but I did hear that the show begins to pick up in later episodes. There were some really solid "Evil Dead" moments, a fair amount of action, some slapstick, some humor and what not. I enjoyed it quite a bit and I am happy it's back as I really missed it.
Yeah i heard bruce and dana mention it picks up after episode 5. Plus add in kain's reactions, 4-5 will be the kick start for when shit starts to go down. Can't wait to see what the build up episodes have to offer.
Just gonna get my two cents out of the way, but first i'm gonna say something. I'm gonna be avoiding mentioning the crude/sex elements for this season cause i can already tell it's going to be chalk full of it and i don't wanna come off as sounding like a broken record for the entire season but for some reason, they aren't as bad this year in comparison to the other two seasons, yeah it's over the top and yes it's still raunchy as ever but here's the plus to it. They go by pretty fast and before you can even grasp what was just said it's moves on to actual dialogue and doesn't stay on it like the previous two seasons did. Anyway's let's begin
Pro's
- Bruce is really going all out and being a lot more alive/loose this season as ash. His a lot more snappier,quick witted and dare i say pulling off a better performance then his done in the previous two seasons. I can already tell i'm going to love what they are gonna pull off with him and brandy, can't wait to see more.
I love how they handled brandy's mothers death, it was a very serious moment for both ash and brandy and there was no joke or punchline right after it either, just a deadite being a asshole and ash getting pissed off and delivering quite the zinger. The aftermath is great as well
- The dialogue, man is it a lot more quicker,fast paced and dare i say a lot better then what we've previously gotten in the past 2 seasons if you look past the crude elements. I actually laughed at both pablo and some of ash's non crude lines, pablo really got off some pretty funny ones. The delivery of everyone's lines in the main three duo is really on point (the little ghostbeaters moment at the end was great, really awesome to see the gang back together.)
- The deadites and how they are handling all of the evil stuff this year is very much in the style of ED2 with a mix of AoD, Rachel's deadite sequence was amazing !
- The soundtrack is really booming this year, it's got a very epic feel to it, i can't wait to see what else joseph has in-store for the later half of this season, his really killing it this year. I hope we get a full release of this seasons soundtrack
- Some will say the pacing is rushed or too quick, but to me it feels like one part of a movie and to me they've nailed the pacing down perfectly this year.
- The fight scenes are a lot more elaborate and planned out this year, it's not ash just going in with a chainsaw and doing his thing while the sidekicks stand back and watch getting in 1 blow from behind. Everyone get's involved and has their moments to shine besides just ash it really feels like it's going to be a team effort for this season, can't wait to see what else is in store cause i have a feeling s3's fight scenes will be remembered the most out of this entire series.
- Out of the two new additions to the cast, brandy is probably my favorite. Arielle delivers a very grounded performance and has great chemistry with bruce. Dalton on the other hand, well his another story.
- The Mythos/ book finally being explored and getting a lot more attention then it previously did in the first two.
- Lucy still killing it, but i have to say like bruce, she's a lot more amped up this season as ruby. They really should've just kept her in this form for the first two.
- Ash being a cocky hardware shelf boy again, just upgraded to manager. And pablo's own business venture as well (THE LOGO, holy shit haha.)
- Some Loose Continuity/Self Awareness between s2's confusing ending and the beginning of this season (Ash's mention of "first linda" , The girl who discovers the book in the after credits scene and Pablo's mention of nothing changing timeline wise.)
Mixed
- I can tell already dalton isn't going to be much except well a knight for his clan. Though Lindsay does pull off what his been given and does pull off the fanboy/worshipping element quite well along with the ending line his given and ash's response to it, i don't know if it's going to be enough for a whole season but we'll see.
(First and Last time these elements will be mentioned in my reviews for this season)
- The Crude sex jokes were hit and miss, the commercial at the start well, it was meant to be cringy,low key,bad and on the nose (I did laugh at ash's reactions to them not all airing), the rest well they don't overstay their welcome like in the previous seasons where it's long, drawn out and a bore to get through to some actual funny/ real dialogue. Here they are quick,simple, to the point and again don't overstay their welcome and we quickly get to the good stuff.
-While it sucks to see we probably won't know or see what became of linda b, i'm gonna chalk this down to well Hurd probably not having the time to come back for another season and went on to filming another show. But hey guess what, a linda survived ! I think we can all be happy about that little fact and we can finally say ash saved linda.
That about wraps up my full review, it was a solid first episode and i have to admit, i enjoyed this a lot more then s2's opening episode and it's right up there with s1's premiere. Can't wait to see what's next !
Thing's i noticed/Favorite Lines.
- Ash has a new way of reloading his double barrel, he has some type of mechanism now on his belt that helps throw the shells in quick into the barrel. Nice to see ash actually upgrading his shit again !
- Pablo's fish and chips logo
- Original spiderman reference to when bruce was the announcer ? Not for sure on this one but it seemed like it.
- AoD line reference, you'll know it when you hear it
*I'll come back to this if i have anymore things to show off*
"Perfection, and only 22 takes !" - Ash
"You know, i've never seen a town loose it's shit over a hardware store before..." - Pablo
"Well it's time to wake up and smell the lightly scented wax flowers pablo" - Ash
"Hey, I paid for two more spots !" - Ash
"Good, because if you did, i'd have to slit my wrists." - Rachel (Dark Comedy at it's finest, good lord.)
"Give me a hint.." *Punch* "I said a hint !" - Ash
"Dude....i told you to get that shit lazered off !" - Ash to Pablo
"Well this daughter of ours probably think's i'm pretty special !" "dream on, i told her you were some crack dealer that was shanked in prison" "What?!"
"I met my first linda here..." - Ash
"Ash went back in time and saved me, it was so cool ! But also really weird, cause when we got back, nothing seemed to have change !" - Pablo
"But you can call me dad ! Unless your a deadite, then you can go fuck yourself !" - Ash
"Blow !" - Ash
"Sorry jailbait, my dance card is a little full. I'll have to squeeze you in." - Ash
"Suck on that harpo..." - Ash
"I know, it sucks. I remember my first taste of evil..." - Ash
"Believe it or not that's my daughter, sandy. ahh..mandy !" "...Brandy, AND FUCK YOU !" "Were still getting to know each other..."
"Kelly pablo,...other guy. You up for this ?" "ONE FOR ALL, AND ALL FOR ONE !" "Ahh Cute, but no..."
"GHOSTBEATERS ARE BACK !" "Fuckin aye right we are !"
As soon as the episode hit the internet(s) I tried to watch it, but mother nature wasn't having any of it as the wind ended up knocking the power out three separate times. Now my first thought of "Family" was Ash's hardware store commercial was just as cheesy as I had thought it would be, but they followed it up with Ash doing a sort of heroic pose while talking with Pablo with a flashing blue light on a pole behind him which was a nice nod to Army of Darkness. Plus those force shots after the Necronomicon was read again were pretty amazing, but I couldn't help wondering if we will see anymore of Amy as it would be kind of weird to have her taken out so quickly as Ruby made her grand entrance into the barn. She didn't seem to be among the bodies that were strewn about, but I have only watched it once. Also we totally should have gotten this version of Ruby from the start because Lucy does pure evil very well. I also really like Brandy as she fits in perfectly with the gang as well as Rachael who as a Deadite provided us with some more Army of Darkness like moments involving the musical instruments like the drum sticks which was cool to see. However, we hardly even got to know poor Candy which was kind of shocking to me... and I'm also not sure what the think of Dalton being a member of the Knights of Sumeria as well as an Ash Williams fanboy.
I will not go into details because I'm waiting the end of the season to do a whole review...but sincerely, as an ED fan, this was a first painful episode to watch. Not good at all. Bruce told us the Evil Dead universe will change for ever this season. Unfortunately, I believe him.
I don't have much to say at the moment cause there really isn't much in this episode to comment on, so for now I'll only say this:
The actress playing Brandy is actually pretty good (can't say much about the character just yet).
The wink at the audience about the time travel plot from last season not having any effect on the present was lame. And lazy. I'd honestly prefer they just didn't mention anything rather than this self aware winking.
Ruby's character, motivations and plans still aren't clear enough and don't seem to make much sense.
This season seems to be a little more purposeful in terms of story than the previous two so hopefully the usual lack of focus won't be a problem.
At least they seem to be making an effort to make the deadite action scenes more inventive.
There was one particular Ash moment in this episode that was delivered in a way I wasn't expecting - far more earnest than usual - and offered us a glimpse of a less one dimensional character that I could actually get behind. Unfortunately, the moment lasts about two seconds. I'm talking about the "taste of evil" line. I want more of that Ash, please. Outside of that moment, I'm still having a hard time even recognizing this character as Ash.
On a more general note, nearly every single problem I had with the previous two seasons is apparently still here. A couple of lines and reactions made me chuckle, but most of the dialogue is still pretty bad. For every good line, there's about three or four cringeworthy ones.
All in all, this premiere episode really didn't do much to make my stance on the show more positive or favorable. Let's see how it develops from here. I said I'd give them one more chance and I meant it.
Mixed bag for me, with a thumb slightly cantered upward.
The Good
Brandy, 100 percent. Arielle Carver-O'Neill is a revelation, and gives a really natural and sympathetic performance as Brandy, who's something of an echo of Ash's early pre-cabin innocence.
The gore and body horror feel 100 percent more Evil Dead like, with the side-benefit of feeling more squirmworthy as horror should. Shout out specifically to Ruby's quickie Necronomicon pregnancy and Brandy's friend taking a harp to the head.
So do the Deadite's behavior, which finally feel properly Evil Dead 2/AOD mischievous. These are Deadites; they want to fuck with humanity but they also want to have a good time doing it.
The taste of Evil mini-monologue, immediately subverted by Ash being yanked through a window by Cougie.
The callbacks were less gratuitous this time out, with several Army of Darkness ones that were very nice.
The Mixed
If you can lampshade Linda B's existence, then you can take a moment and say she moved out of town. It's one line of dialogue and it'd fucking help.
One liners are scattershot: "Suck on that, Harpo" was funny, at least.
Ahh, the sexual humor. It's incredibly scattershot as always, and some of the jokes landed, but the idea of Ash randomly slinging dildos and the cringeworthy wedding scene with Candy was a bit much.
Kain is right and they've dialed his intelligence down in a Homer Simpson-like fashion, which is funny and annoying at turns. Really? Using a condom fifty times?
Cougie was dispensed with wayy too early in the series. Most memorable monster yet, and they kill him off right away!
The Bad
I am still incredibly annoyed that Ruby is this badass, all powerful demon who's smart enough a demon to write this all-powerful book, yet for two seasons in a row her entire motivational arc has been about her trying to get pregnant/create children. Once would be understandable. Pressing the reset button so she could do it AGAIN this season is damned annoying, and it just fits the predictable rigmarole of never working out
Though I sense that's her spawn's final form Ash tries to blow away with a tank in the season finale
, but in any event it really curtails her character over and over again. Why does she want to raise a child? She's an immortal demon! She can do this shit herself! If continuity hasn't changed anything WHY IS SHE REPEATING THE SAME MISTAKE SHE MADE IN SEASON 2? But as DyD said, she was fascinating in season one but now she's fairly one-note. At least Lucy is visibly having fun with it.
"Oh by the way, nothing that happened in season 2 actually changed anything!" Shamelessly lazy. Just address your mistakes and then move on, show.
If this is true, WHY IS BROCK STILL DEAD?
Did they forget that the girl who picked up the Nec in the woods last season had a Valley Girl accent? I liked the general continuity with the sweater but c'mon.
Candy was charming, interesting, and a waste of intense presence. I think they needed her for a couple more episodes.
Dalton feels like a total waste of space so far, and currently doesn't have much of a plot purpose aside from worshipfully staring and sighing at Ash, which used to be Pablo's job.
Kelly still feels underdeveloped as hell. I get it, show, she says fuck a lot and is into the old ultraviolence. GIMMIE MORE TO WORK WITH!
Questions/Observations
Brandy learned pretty quickly from what seems to be the show's consistent message: don't light up a j or you'll destroy the world and everyone around you.
So Ruby's pregnancy
Is the spawn she created part-Ash/part-her, or will it be whoever provided the blood for that illustration?
SUMMATION: I felt like this was about middle of the pack for season premieres, but it was engaging enough and built Brandy up in a non-annoying way, and set out some ground material for what we're going to see.
I don't have much to add. Fratboy humor, that unrecogniseable character randomly named Ash - I don't want to repeat myself. But in my opinion the pacing and over all directing really improved.
They cut off that rockin' upeat retrospective.
The hallway scene was much better than expected from that crappy teaser.
Deadites finally behave like deadites again.
The barn / shaky cam montage worked quite well.
And as far as I can judge as a non-native-speaker the dialogue also improved a little bit.
Beeing generous and ignoring all the stuff I hate since the end of S1, I would give it something between a solid D+ and a weak B-.
Plothole?
Evil Ruby waited 30 years without looking for the book in ruins of the cabin? A School Girl had to find it?
Honestly, I don't know. If you are able to ignore that Ash plays mentally in the same league as Homer Simpson or Peter Griffin, you'll get solid entertainment. I mean in AoD he puts Sheila down for not having the intellectuel ability to understand the molecular composition of materials. In this episode the very same character is proud to reuse a condom fifty times ...
My personal opinion: I am not that illusional to hope to see an Ash portrayal like in ED2 or even like in AoD again. But if they would just bring him back to the part-time idiot / part-time stoic action hero level he had at the start of the show, I could live much better with all the other cringeworthy stuff. For example in this scene from "Bait" (or another one from the same episode, in which he is talking about the latest evil Invasion not being his "first rodeo") he feels much more like the Ash character I like, just from the way he is talking ...
My problem with Ash's characterization on the show is that they made him so unbelievably objectionable, unaware of the world around him and the consequences of his actions, dumb and one note that he doesn't even feel like a human being anymore. He's no longer a character, but a caricature. Like Muzzlehatch said, he's become Peter Griffin, deadite slayer. They made him nearly impossible to relate to. As much as I was initially opposed to the daughter subplot, I've been seeing some stuff related to his dynamic with Brandy that might bring out a slightly more stoic, focused, serious and even heroic Ash to go along with the irresponsible, distracted and impulsive side of the character, so in the end the inclusion of the daughter subplot might be beneficial to the character. It might help make the character more human and relatable once again. Here's hoping. Finger's crossed.
I mean in AoD he puts Sheila down for not having the intellectuel ability to understand the molecular composition of materials. In this episode the very same character is proud to reuse a condom fifty times ...
My problem with Ash's characterization on the show is that they made him so unbelievably objectionable, unaware of the world around him and the consequences of his actions, dumb and one note that he doesn't even feel like a human being anymore. He's no longer a character, but a caricature. Like Muzzlehatch said, he's become Peter Griffin, deadite slayer. They made him nearly impossible to relate to.
The ultimate problem with Ash's AvED character is that they've forgotten his thoughtline, which I know I've mentioned before. To invoke the Three Stooges, he used to be Moe - hyper self-serious, the constant victim of the eyepokes of others. The show's turned him into a light-brained Curly type.
The ultimate problem with Ash's AvED character is that they've forgotten his thoughtline, which I know I've mentioned before. To invoke the Three Stooges, he used to be Moe - hyper self-serious, the constant victim of the eyepokes of others. The show's turned him into a light-brained Curly type.
Honestly, i pefer this ash over the one we got in the previous seasons, at least this one is actually showing more emotions/layers and feels more lively then he has in the previous seasons. But that's just opinion on it. Plus his actually upgraded his gear finally, that's another plus in my book with this ash. (The belt reloader)
Even Kelly and Pablo have a bit more of a spring in their step with their dialogue and delivery.
To me, i think craig leaving might have been the best decision they could've made, if they didn't we would probably be watching ash and pablo currently chasing down baal for a whole damn season. I know everyone here wouldn't have wanted that scenario at all including me. So picking between the lesser of two evils here, we got the better deal imo.
Honestly, i pefer this ash over the one we got in the previous seasons, at least this one is actually showing more emotions/layers and feels more lively then he has in the previous seasons. But that's just opinion on it. Plus his actually upgraded his gear finally, that's another plus in my book with this ash. (The belt reloader)
Even Kelly and Pablo have a bit more of a spring in their step with their dialogue and delivery.
To me, i think craig leaving might have been the best decision they could've made, if they didn't we would probably be watching ash and pablo currently chasing down baal for a whole damn season. I know everyone here wouldn't have wanted that scenario at all including me. So picking between the lesser of two evils here, we got the better deal imo.
It's a bit early to tell this Ash and Cie are better this season than the previous ones. I did not see a single difference. In fact. I felt the dialogue & story a bit rushed. I was like " Hey! we need to set up the basic story of S3 in 27minutes! Bring immidately all the new characters right now!". I don't know, I'm tired of dick , drugs and sperm jokes. I just felt Ash was there 2 second when Brandy's mother died.
I think Craig was a bad showrunner, and the new one won't be better. If you compare both first episodes of all seasons, this one is the weakest one. I don't think we have a better deal here.
It's a bit early to tell this Ash and Cie are better this season than the previous ones. I did not see a single difference. In fact. I felt the dialogue & story a bit rushed. I was like " Hey! we need to set up the basic story of S3 in 27minutes! Bring immidately all the new characters right now!". I don't know, I'm tired of dick , drugs and sperm jokes. I just felt Ash was there 2 second when Brandy's mother died.
I think Craig was a bad showrunner, and the new one won't be better. If you compare both first episodes of all seasons, this one is the weakest one. I don't think we have a better deal here.
I'm gonna have to disagree, i didn't think it was rushed in the slightest. They set-up the basic's of the season just fine and from what i've heard these next two episodes will be more build up episodes then 4-5 will be when shit starts to go down, so i would hold out and wait before crying wolf here, so let's put the breaks on.
The sex jokes are always going to be there, let's be honest with ourselves. At least with this season they are more quick and to the point and go by pretty fast while craig would hang on that shit forever. So imo we've gotten the better deal, at least with this guy his actually giving the characters more emotional scenes even if they go quick they are still there, we barely got any of that with craigs run.
Honestly, i pefer this ash over the one we got in the previous seasons, at least this one is actually showing more emotions/layers and feels more lively then he has in the previous seasons.
I'm a little bit on the fence as to whether or not Ash is better or worse this season. I need to get deeper into it. I will say it's better than the girlfriend of the season stuff and the weird quasi-racist stuff from season one.
I'm also willing to agree on the Baal situation, if only because by doing this we avoid the Ash-and-Kelly-are-related plot.
